A Professional Carpenter did THIS - I Was Shocked

yep had roofers MISS the entire wooden batterns or just split them out the sides

Exactly the reason I do all my own work. I know a handful of people who I would trust to do work on my house, but you have to book them well in advance because they’re always busy. Seen too many that’ll do merchants in the game. Hope you didn’t pay them all the money.

The infill joists at the side of the velux windows are fine nailed, they carry no weight. I'd say you are over stating the load bearing capacity and making it sound worse than it actually is. The sheer strength of screws can be more than adequate for most intended purposes, it's the surface friction from screw or nail compression that clamps the timber, stops slippage, not the sheer of fixings, Joist hangers came about to regularise jointing timber to make it idiot proof, as most so called tradesmen today fall into that category. Aside from truss clips, I never use them. If joists are nailed correctly (with 100mm heavy gauge galv hammer in nails ) and properly supported they are not needed. Look at any house built before 1980 when proper nails were used. Metal hangers are actually shit and a poor solution.

Twist nails are also high tensile steel like gold screws, the heads snap off twist nails quite easily!

Where we are we have specific nails and nailer for attaching hangars to the beam, that have a higher shear strength than regular nails

What are you something I I work in the housing industry I basically sort out squeaky floors et i’ve had numerous conversations with NHBC about, square fix nails that you suggested nine times out of 10 they come out if there’s any movement in the floor or structure, they will come out we need to remove them and then put screws in because the joist hangers fall out that’s just in my experience.

Certainly an interesting take on things.
I'm not going to defend the framers' use of hangers in this application. And I would have run screws the way you did.
But, it appears that the skylights were added after the fact, which explains their shoddyness. To a certain extent.
I also cringed at the screw heads sticking out of the hangers.
I guess the main thing that bugged me is the use of the word "structural". Generally that doesn't just mean it's part of the structure. It means that the component has a critical stress or load bearing component to it.
The framing of a skylight is not load bearing or stressed. It just holds up the frame of the skylight.
For that purpose square twist nails are probably overkill. Although I liked those screws and hopefully I can get some of those around here!
Secondly, those long screws specifically state they are for timber framing. That's a different animal than what you're doing there. Again kind of overkill.

Your a total idiot and a liar , there is no way you can put joist hangers on with a first fix gun you would never be able to find the holes in the hanger , agreed the gaps are bad , why was the rafters not doubled up in the set out instead of doubles with a gap alongside the rafters looks like an after thought to me , you should use twist nails but if screws are used and fully sent home they will never shear , you are showing them shear when they are not fully home , a typical DIY guy

You know there's also a very good chance that person that did the framing did this on the ground so all of those places where the connectors are there's a very good chance there's a nail in there already as you pointed out there is a gap on either end I think that would be a good indicator that somebody nailed it together on the ground then had a friend's help to nail it to the other framing that was already up in the ceiling so those screws which you are very correct in pointing out they are not nearly as strong as the nails although I'm mixing apples and oranges here the nails are more flexible they're softer actually dim the screws the screws they are harder but more brittle which is why it is that you were able to bend the nail multiple times put the screw broke after just once hitting the side of it also could not see but if you were to toenail it then it would be real strong but of course you wouldn't want to toenail it if it doesn't extend to the proper length as you showed me but those Simpson plates they cover for multitude of sins so that's just Overkill if there's already Nails banged into the ends through the boards or toenails into the boards from the side and that's actually a wonderful thing actually about nails when you hammer a nail you can do this sideways now maybe that doesn't make sense to people but can I explain it to you this way do you see how those people do the skateboards alright how do you jump up into the air when you're standing on a skateboard will they have the name I forget what it's called Ollie's I think it's called that's something that is apparently a lot easier then it looks or am I saying that backwards it's a lot harder than it looks so I don't see a problem with it but then you probably have a trained eye for structural roof framing

This is what you pay the big bucks for...shoddy shite!

I’m constantly fixing other peoples work. I’m first and second fix carpenter but I did a lot of snagging when I worked on site. I’ve seen some shocking work from all trades because of that. It’s beyond frustrating that people get paid for those bodge jobs.

Especially with the timber not fitted tightly around around those frames then the shit screws used to hold them in place. I’m glad you were able to fix it.

Surely if you want specialist screws you should supply a spec list on all the materials , most of these rough necks don’t care or don’t know or both, But rarely is the work supervised or inspected, most customers are as greedy as these naff tradesmen all they want is cheap and cheaper, they have no money for construction but will pay big money for a daft kitchen or fancy car. You should name this guy put his face on a poster warn your neighbours and if you can kick him off the rest of the job. He’s getting a way with it again.

Love the guys that have to hire out and then critisize on the job they got. Do it yourself next time.

Thanks Aiden! I learned a lot from this video. Please continue teaching us DIYers with these informative videos 🙏🏻

How about my so-called professional builder fixing over 100sqm of plasterboard to the insulation board? Didn't have long enough screws to reach the battens that day, and decided just to "crack on"?

To correct their mistake, I used extra long drywall screws to fix the plasterboard to the battens, then I re-skimmed all the walls. Of course, I didn't get the plasterer in for that, as he couldn't spell "plumb", nevermind achieve it.

Every single contractor & subbie on my last project made numerous, and often visibly horrendous mistakes, and it was the same reason every single time... they just couldn't be arsed doing it right and didn't think I'd notice.

On so many occasions when I did call them out when I noticed poor workmanship, all I got in reply were lies and excuses. The usual classic was, "but we've always done it that way, and we've never had a problem".

I, for one, will never outsource trade work again in my life. Even if they offered to work for free, I'd still straight arm them. Well okay... so maybe a gas engineer. But even then I'd only let them touch the gas side of appliances, and I'd sit behind them while they did their thing.

Apologies to any craftsmen out there, but the whole industry is in ruins as far as I can tell.

You definitely got stung by the Carpenters ......the bee knew better ✌

The proper way to to this kind of roof window frame after the roof has already been made, is with using no hangers/brackets at all. Take precice measurements, then build the frame on a flat surface and finally assemble the entire frame with long screws (wt-t or similar) through the rafters (ca 8x180mm in this case or less if you drive the wt-t through the first rafter) 2-3 screws per connection (depending on the rafters size). The upper WT-T screw can be driven in on an angle (up to 45 degrees). This makes the connection even sturdier. Just make sure that you choose a proper length as per screw manufacturer guidelines.

If that’s as far as the shoddy work goes, I’ll take that all day long, few screws and hangers that aren’t structural I wish

You will never regret spending money on Simpson hardware in the overall cost of your building, our engineering company spec it all the time, great stuff and backed with design data too. Palm nailers are used a lot if using their nails in tight spaces

You should try framing for a living for a year and your work won’t be as good as his.

Maybe check your local code , because legal joist hanger fasteners are screws and required in some areas.

You should video your inspection. Everything is legal just need to straighten out the hanger

If your screws are tight they won't bend and break. Shear strength is way different than your example of a screw breaking.

Stick to your work. Diy ers always think they know better , always wondered why these critics don't just do the job themselves.

The screw or nail is not going to shear of. A 16 penny common nail has a 1600 lb shear strength.

I am a builder and plan designer for over 30 years. You are correct in using nails vs screws not designed for the applications and many builders need to be aware of it. "Do Not " replace nails with screws.
This is a simple "Head-In" so it is supporting the a single roof rafter mid span. From what I see its over kill. Lack of understanding of structural components and connections "TRUE".
The Design fix is very simple we took away 1 roof rafter.
1) We added 2each rafters as double roof rafter to replace 1 rafter = solved for the continuous rafter load no calc need.
2) Structural span of a single head-in 2x6 block @ 32 span. with 3 each 16d nails on each end is about 840lbs. That split for tributary loads applied is 1680 lbs along the rafter . The cross blocking is only supporting the sky-light. The builder is in "OVERKILL"
3) The panel span of the roof sheathing alone without the complies with code.

OMG mate. Their just a couple of trimmers, non load bearing !! Their just there to support the perp ends of the skylight.. what a load of rubbish 😂

Thanks for the video. Its taken me 2 years to put right what one crap contractor did to my house in 5 weeks. He wasted thousands of pounds of materials and bodged everything. All his new stuff was nail gunned together in some sort of spray and pray machine gun style.
I have used Simpson CSA screws for a lot of simpson hangers and connectors as i have been putting things right and they are very good. Like you i like to test everything i use. The 4.0x30mm ones are quite light weight but compare reasonably to twist nails but do not overscrew them. Use a low torque setting on screwdriver mode other wise their pull out resistance is badly affected. Simpson provide load values for the screws and the 4s dont match twist nails in shear but have better pull out resistance if not overtightened. Best to check if in doubt.
The 5.0s come in length 35-80mm and combined with simspon brackets and hangers make seriously strong joints. Again dont overtighten toachieve best results.
They do snap in the waggle test when tested individually and not fully inserted but when used in a plate or hanger iwth others they dont waggle.

I've never over priced or made a fortune on a job but always corrected my mistakes for nothing as I know nothing compared to those so called professional's who's work I correct. The first thing I learned is that it's easy for those with no skill to complain about a tradesman skill's that came before them when that tradesman is not onsite rather then admit your own mistakes.

Your making a big fuss over hardly anything.
How do you know where the guy nailed if you cant see behind the doubled up framing.
All i see is alot of screws in the joist hangers where there should be scews but any screws will work that are exterior coated.
I hurricane could hit that building and those ski lights wont budge.
Your a diy guy thats full of shht.
Go and work on a real building site and youll see some hacks but alot of great carpenters too. You just wanna give out about something

I've been an accomplished DIY'er since before puberty. One thing I learned very early is that the title "professional" gives you license to do poor quality work.
I had occasion to hire a "professional union painter" once to paint an exterior wall using spray equipment. Having no experience with spray painting equipment, I was afraid I would just get paint where paint doesen't belong, so I thought it best to hire it out.

He got paint on the door hardware.

It would have taken, literally, 90 seconds using a phillips screwdriver to remove the hardware. When I asked him why he didn't simply remove it, he replied "That's a mechanics job. I'm a Union painter". I fired him, right then and there.

I have never been ashamed of ANY of my DIY work. I am NOT a professional, and never will be. Thank you very much.

The middle, upper class are begging craftsmen to work and to pay them Tax. I get multiple lucrative wage offers every day.
Remember, they refused to pay us trade craftsman real money 20 years ago. Instead they began importing cheap foreign labour to replace us.
I said back then, good luck with that, take a look at the buildings where your importing the labour from.
Without new blood our quality trades, craftsmen will disappear.
We’re beginning to resemble South Africa’s demise.

Yep you want to get screwed hire a semi pro professional. Been there and learned my lesson. Find a great professional or do it yourself.

I always wondered why use a nail instead of a screw. Thanks for explaining Aiden!

They used screws because you can take it off with ease to fix their work.

Not sure what regs recommend the full fill insulation you have in first,regardless of breather membrane. It will not vent enough. Leave an air gap use pir between. Regardless if you attempt to vapour Barrier

hangers should have twist nails

i had someone come and build two cupboard doors for under floor storage at my house. he brought his apprentice of the year trophy to show me. he proceded to cut everything crooked, snap off screws he didnt predrill and use zinc hinges and hasps and stables outside that rusted within a year.

It's not perfect, but it's not structural either--so I"m not convinced it's worth the time and effort to fix it.

No most screws are not technically rated for stctural applications as you demonstarted, the screws can shear after repeated bending. The issue here is that most nails can and will back out over time, ring shank are a bit better. Screws dont have this issue and truthfully the screws will never experience the level of shear force that you demonstrated. So basically while the screws may not be rated for high shear loads, those screws wont be failing on account of this and they wont be backing out like many nails do.

Hi aiden, I'm a roofer by trade and just want to give you a heads up up about the insulation in the rafters. If it has been stuffed and Is touching the felt you may experience some sweating. I advise that you take it out and use kingspan instead before it is all plaster boarded. Could save you a lot of money and hassle in the future

My dad insisted on doing everything himself bc everyone just over charges these days and you have to call them back multiple times to fix their shoddy work. Actually broke my moms antique China cabinet one time. She was mortified.

That's what happens when we don't value Qualifications. City & Guilds apprenticeships were dulled down since the late 1980's-early 90's and since then we have de-valued them. We know the price the everything and the value of nothing. But apparently everyone should go to university for a worthless degree and 85% of them never pay back their tuition fees of £50,000 plus.

In the UK Many tradesmen can be simply cowboys , they advertise their service online, facebook, Checkatrade, if they come to do the work and they leave, leave mistakes behind, it's all cash in hand and No one Regulates them.

British people complain too much about foreigners working in the UK.

If more tradesmen from overseas were allowed to work in the UK, the standards would be be better. The British tradesman who came to do some work in my house made mistakes in both jobs. All cash in hand. I complained afterwards he simply ignored me and disappeared.

Nah mate, that's an expansion gap 😁 typical DIYer misunderstanding. I'm afraid I'm guilty of using the wrong screw in some arris rail brackets, and when we did have very strong winds, yes, a couple did sheer off, but I think that is well spotted because not everybody might notice.

Very educational. I didn't know that about square twist nails!!

I really appreciate your handiwork and use how fix and build something the right way.
But please refrain from showing that screw nail bending again, It’s wrong. Probably fastened screw and nails are loaded with tension and sheer forces not bending.