Acoustic vs digital pianos - difference in tone and touch; Roberts Pianos

I think that polyphony is the thing that makes it or brakes it. On that acoustic piano all notes are ringing throughout the whole piece, same does not apply do Kawai. I wonder if Roland with SuperNatural modeling would do better (since it has unlimited polyphony)?

As Marcus' son, I was born into the piano trade. As a keyboard player myself I was part of setting up our digital piano department. I own a Casio PX-150 digital piano which I bought here in Houston TX. It has served me well. I can record with it, I use Logic Pro X, the MIDI side makes for an easier editing of each note even the attack etc. Surprisingly respected jazz pianists (see Ivory software) are using digital pianos to record as they make it much easier to edit if you accidently hit a second note. Ultimately they are playing a recorded version of a piano. So the record sounds good.

I also used to play at church services with a USB plugged into my Mac laptop, but found cables, battery levels, software interfaces more complication than a solution. Consequently sticking to onboard sounds on the available digital piano.

Unless you are a studio musician, do not buy a digital piano without internal speakers. When you have to power on a digital piano, and check the cables and power of the speakers, then the connection to software, it makes music a production. I now leave my digital piano turned on all day. Inspiration rapidly fly's the nest of creatives when it isn't written down by pen, or recorded on a DAW (digital audio workstation) or mobile phone.

Immersion wise, the best digital piano is always a recording, an unnatural experience when you think about how natural a piano is. From the parts of the action, to the strings, damper felt and woods, spruce soundboard, wood underneath the tuning pins and on the front and sides of the piano, an acoustic piano is beyond the strings and hammers. Reproducing wood with MDF or a substitute might make you feel comfortable. Samples are making things much easier to work with, but lack the warmth and depth of a real piano.

We do however understand, practical speaking, that it is understandable that in circumstances where you are in a transition period as a student moving into small accommodation, or as a retired person in a retirement home, living in a flat. A piano is practically and socially unacceptable. Additionally as a tool for nighttime study or recording. We believe the digital piano has a place, but currently is a synthetic replacement for acoustic instruments. This may change in the future.

I'm thinking about getting an acoustic piano for 300$ from krangslist this July 2017! I'm sooo exited, what's better? 500$ Electric Williams Or 300$ Acoustic Upright Piano? And I mean for songs like, Heathens and Fur Elise. Not 90's rock

Hi there, Robert

My piano right now is around 100 years old. It's a little out of tune (435 A) and I'm looking at some new ones. The question is, should I purchase a new acoustic piano?

Hi, I'm Marcio and I'm a pianist, I'm also looking to buy a hybrid piano with the best action in the market, because like you said in the video that's what a piano is all about... but there's a new hybrid piano that no one is talking about... it's from Schulze Pollmann a very well known brand and it's call "ilpiano" Can You Roberts Pianos make a video about it... there's a lot features that a picture can't reveal, like the action, the technology imbedded on capturing the sound, the mechanics of the keyboard, the sound, etc... Before I make the buy it's important to know what are the best options in the market, up until now Yamaha is the best, but if the money is not an issue a Alpha piano is the Ferrari of the Hybrid world... thank you all for everything...

Which idiot made that Digital piano ,their sound is so dead ,it need to add some echo .Guitars have already done that in their digital sound amp ,piano look like really weak coded digitally

What I don't like about digitals is that bass tones tend to be overdubbed.

I think this test is biased (not intentionally). Probably the mic placement was less than optimal for the digital, I have listened to videos of digital pianos of much lower quality than CA97 sounding much better than here. I'm sure if the sound was taken from the line out or the mic placement was better the difference would have been much lower than in this video.

the lower register on the digital was not very good was it?

Digitals are great for learners though

Hi! Great video, the acoustic sounds lovely!
What's the name of the song that's played in the video?

Salespeople have told a piano teacher's pupils that "a digital pianos is better than a Steinway" (of course the latter is not available in stock) and I recently saw an advert on Gumtree stating emphatically that "Roland is the best piano maker in the world>" Of course there's no "best" but at the present time, to my ear, there is no comparison: the digital piano sounds artificial, and that's what it is. The comparison here between the Fuerich upright and the digital piano illustrates this clearly, even though the recording is obviously not doing justice to the differences. Perhaps they layperson who can't hear the difference should ask the question, if the digital instrument is better or even comparable to the acoustic piano, why are acoustic pianos and not their digital counterparts on the stages of the world's concert halls and being played by the great pianists? Someone in this column says that on a digital piano "the sound can be manipulated better." I wonder if he has the ears to hear the colours and nuances that, say, Horowitz achieved on his Steinway?

Not even close... especially in bass region

digital is superficial😵even for a kawai

I live in France and soon the Phoenix piano from Adele Music will be out. It's a revolution in non-acoustic pianos they say. The owner is a very passionate designer and the development took 4 years with engineers and concert techs. It's not sampling but physical modelled sound. Even the vibrations of all the "mecanism" is modelled, you can feel all this. They say that you can "hear what you touch" with an advanced "psychoacoustic" approach and "real time algorithmic calculation modeling (sympathetic resonance, bowed strings, hammer noises, etc.)" The speakers are from Focal, a very renowned Hi-Fi french brand. The piano have been tested by some french concert pianists and they say that this was the best keyboard touch from a non-acoustic instrument they've ever seen. And you can put it in a suitcase because you can bend it (sorry for my bad english) but I don't care about the mobility. Anyway it's gonna be expensive but not as the Yam TransAcoustic hybrids. I can't have a real acoutic at home, because of space and neighbours. This is my only hope to have something that is different from everything else and almost like an acoustic but i'm afraid this will not be. Still I can't wait to try it.

yeah there's a huge gap. acoustic sounds so much richer. no contest

The difference is astonishing.

I like both but prefer the Kawai because of the slightly clearer tone.

I think there are better digital pianos out there than this kawai. Didnt sound that great to me

For years, I sponsored to my friends\audience digital pianos as a definitive substitutes for the most bulky and (I thought ) obsolete conventionals pianos.

I was blinded by the glare of electronics, able to offer 4 or 5 types of stereo piano samples on 88 keys range ......and I was enchanted by the proportional weighted "hammer action" technologies of the most sophisticated keyboards (for instance the Yamaha Clavinova series).. technology stacks able to almost emulate the "real touch" almost entirely......

Blinded .......Until I started studying the internal architecture of a digital piano :-)

What's the KEY difference between a real .....and a digital piano?

A real piano is a parallel analog machine made by 88 channels (excluding the pedals).

Each channel can be independently modulated .... all the process occurs in REAL TIME.

A digital piano is a "machine" composed by a polyphonic sound generator and a master keyboard ....................joined together by a single electronic pipe .....

Not necessarily the 2 things were coming from the same Company \ Factory....

Ergo ... there was a need to build a standard pipe and adopt\adapt a protocol able to combine the two things together....

No .... nobody considered even for a second to implement a parallel architecure with 88 pipes ... Chopin was not working for Yamaha, Roland, Korg...

Parallel things are expensive :-)

Yes.... a pipe is intrinsecally a serial thing that puts events and messages in a queue...but who cares .... ;-)

And for not reinventing the wheel ... the fundamental protocol responsible for reading the performance of a pianist transforming all the things into serial messages could not (economically sustainable) be anything other than .................................MIDI !!!!!!!

MIDI it's a wonderful serial protocol running at 31250 bits per second almost 40 years old invented for managing the synths of the 80s !! Not professional piano playing....

Now, who goes outside to explain to a professional pianist that even a super expensive digital piano is internally a serial machine where all the richness of expression, modulation, speed, aftertouch are interpreted and transformed into SERIAL MESSAGES transported (with 'some' latency) to a sound card @ more or less 4kbytes per second?

In 2018?

No ....... Maybe it's better to hide a bit these things under a biiiiiig marketing carpet.

:-)

The electronic piano, compared to a "real" (acoustic) piano sounds fatty and bloated. It's not disagreeable, but the sound is too plummy and artivicial

Like your voice :)

I love the regular piano found myself. I have two Roland digital pianos and one regular piano there is no comparison as far as I'm concerned.

The problem with most digital pianos is that they sound acoustic pianos played through walkie talkies

Digital pianos have their advantages.

A real piano is always authentic. However...a digital piano is a very good substitute, which never needs tuning..weighs under 30 kilos and take up little space. And they sound and feel surprisingly good. I have moved a grand piano once....That's the first and last time I tried that.: )

The feel of the hammer striking the key, which allows me to produce my own personal tone, is far more satisfying than a manufactured piano sound. Beginners need acoustics from the "get-go," because they need to learn to make a beautiful sound, not have it already provided for them.

How about Roland's latest LX-series?

The Yamaha CLP-600 series (CFX Grand) has a much better and richer sound than upright pianos for me. The bass is much richer like a grand piano and the treble "sings" with the sampled CFX Grand's own personality.

Digitals sound "muddy" in the lower register. They also ALL have stiffer action than good acoustic pianos (even digitals equipped with those "action adjusting dials.") And the sustenuto pedals are much stiffer, and harder to depress with your leg/foot while properly being able to keep your shoe heel on the floor. Digital pedals cannot be adjusted. I've bought two high quality digitals (over a 13 year period) and returned them both within a week. If you're a discriminating musician...you decide.

At the high end the digital did very well but still lost the battle.
In the base, the acoustic totally destroyed the digital.

The tone is warmer and richer on the upright. Even if you dish out thousands to get a good electric, it can never compare with an acoustic.

I have owned a digital piano (Roland’s top model at the time) for twenty years. I bought it to save wear and tear on my real instrument, and it has saved me a fortune in tuning and regulation on the latter. The keys stopped working properly ages ago, but as a practice tool it’s still hugely useful: and one can work all night (with headphones); also, it’s fun using the different temperaments, not to mention switching it to harpsichord! One real advantage is that, even in a small space, it has the acoutic of a piano in a large hall, which is a huge help in refining pedalling. The big disadvantage is that the amount of physical effort to play virtuoso passagework is tiny compared to a big steinway, and an inexperienced player could easily be misled!!

Just hearing you testing those pianos, it's such a purifying experience! So amazing!

There´s no comparison !

As a working pianist and one who plays both acoustic and digital I could really tell the difference. Doesn’t matter how digitals get and the high quality of them they will never actually sound as the acoustic counter part. I play both as I stated and love them both my first love is the digital though. Yes. The feeling and tonality is different on both acoustic and digital. Though they have gotten really good over the years still a digital will never bee an acoustic and an acoustic will never bee a digital. That is what makes them so unique. Even the hybrids are not digitals. They are acoustic pianos with digital parts but they are really not a true digital piano. Personally, i love Yamaha digital pianos the best. I have one and i love it!!!

You have to bear in mind that we are listening to a recording through a mobile phone. It just isn't going to sound 'good'. It will very much depend on where the digital piano speakers are and their orientation, an acoustic instrument is much less directional. One of the most significant advantages of an electronic instrument is that you can play a digital instrument through headphones at any time of the day or night, you can also add audio effects to the sound and record the results much easier. There will be sound from the keybed but at a significantly lower level than the sound of an acoustic instrument.

Either option has advantages and disadvantages. A digital piano on a stand can be stored in a cupboard; an acoustic piano is part of the room. An acoustic piano needs tuning and maintenance occasionally, whereas a digital piano may become unrepairable in a decade. An acoustic instrument has essentially one sound, a digital instrument can have numerous piano, organ, string sounds - which can be layered and split over the keys. However, I doubt you will be playing the digital piano you buy today in a hundred years. A digital piano can have adjustable key action, do if you play hard or soft you can tailor the key response, an acoustic instrument is not so easily adjusted. You may not want to play an out of tune real piano, but a digital is only out of tune if you make it so, generally.

If I had the space and money I would undoubtedly buy an acoustic grand piano and probably also a digital instrument. For most people, this isn't an option. But you can get a lot of enjoyment playing a digital instrument.

I struggle by with a 88 note midi controller with piano app on an iPad.
It produces a really good sound and although the keys probably don't give the best feel in comparison to a real piano, it's not bad.

You can be snobbish if you like, but realistically an acoustic piano is of no use to me.

What piece are you playing?

The problem is that the digital piano is imitating a grand piano, while the other one is an upright. A fair comparison would be if you used the upright option on the digital and compared it to the real upright, or used the grand piano sound and compared it to a real grand piano.

What lovely, musical playing. Did my heart good.

Though sound and tone is never a match to an acoustic piano the Kawai's keyboard action feels very nice to play (almost like a true grand). When considering a digital piano it's mostly for being able to practice quietly for many hours. Any of the Kawai CA6's and above sound and feel really good , the CA97 was replaced by a newer version and it sound MUCH better.

For me the FEURICH MOD. 123 - VIENNA "MADE IN AUSTRIA"

Acoustic pianos sound beautiful, however I very much enjoy adding stereo delay and plate reverb with the flick of a knob

Try getting that acoustic up the stairs at Blair Hall. Bad enough with the Hammond, so I'll stick to the Nord. Each has it's place.

The fact is acoustic pianos are just not practical for most people who want to learn/play. Cost, maintenance, space and volume are all major issues for families with children neighbours (other family members who god forbid want to do something quietly elsewhere) digital pianos have opened piano learning to thousands who otherwise would never have a chance to learn. Much like uprights did 100 years ago. Let’s face it given the money and the space we’d all have a grand piano anyway 😂

The Kawai sounds recorded/electronic. It doesn't have to sound that way in all keys all the time but you know it when you have heard a couple of times. You can tweak it to make it less pronounced but only up to a limit (it gives you some freedom of changing the sound). You should expect that the newer the version, the less pronounced it should be as they keep refining their sound. Bear in mind that this is one of the best electronic (digital) pianos you can get but still not the top of the range Kawai. Right now VPC1 and MP11se are their best keyboard-only offerings (you need headphones or external audio system to hear these) which are quite economical as real piano keyboard alternatives. Then they have the CA901 - their top of the range upright - and the DG30 - a small grand like - digital pianos which are many times more expensive than the keyboard only-models.

Kawai uses variations of similar key action mechanism technologies across their digital piano range so you need to check which one it is you are buying before committing as the action technology becomes better within the same series as you move up in price. However, there may be a cheaper alternative in another series with the same key action - or an only slightly outdated version of the same key action if buying an older second hand model.

With second hand electronic (digital) pianos, you still need to have them inspected by someone experienced. Among other things, the action does have mechanical parts that wear (or break) with playing which can affect the touch (or the longevity of the mechanism). Usually these are elastomers or bushings which may become compacted or worn (or dry in the case they come lubricated originally) leaving the key feeling loose and/or resulting in the key not stopping in the same way as in an unworn action. Especially the latter can be annoying but both are signs of wear. The wear can result in uneven key height or spacing just as in a normal piano.

You need to hear a digital piano both through headphones (if you plan on using them) and through its own speaker.
Finally, there is the option of installing a silent piano mechanism to a normal piano which is the best/worst possible solution depending on what you are after. This last one is as expensive as buying a piano but may be what you want.