Christian revival: Fantasy or reality? - UnHerd LIVE

i dont think anyone wants this lady on these programs shes such a fuicking charlatan get her off

"God shaped hole" applies to some and not others. I heard that BS when I was a kid, and yet no doing of the God stuff actually made God show up to this so called "God shaped hole."

I say I am agnostic because I can't prove the absolute nonexistence of anything. I can say that the things that worked for other people didn't work for me.

Alex embodies intellectual integrity.

I definitely enjoy these types of discussions, where both sides aren't accusatory and acknowledge the value of each other's opinions that are being brought.

This is practically unwatchable due to the extreme amount of ads.

Atheism isn’t the main false idol, money is. I mean there are so many about but ultimately the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit will sort this out

“do you save your mother with that worldview”😭😭alex is so funny

This narrativization of the world will lead to another Heideggar. What is personally right may not be globally true

The church would need to stop being woke.

Alex o Connor might be the youngest and most clear thinking one among the one.

I think the “revival” is a drive to suppress marginalized communities and restrict women’s rights. Maybe it is different in the UK. Then you had this weeping about finding “meaning in life”. You deal with what is in front of you, mitigate problems, leave others alone, die and be forgotten, just like almost everyone else who has ever lived. 74 years and two wars, never needed a purpose other than do the job in front of me to get through the day. “The need to feel part of something larger” get over yourself.

Joseph Smith gave another excellent testimony of the resurrection. Sadly he was gunned down.

Changing what was finite, into something infinite requires empathy.

Tom Holland? as in Spiderman?

Really good Pod

Anti-wokeness only situationally cates about evidence for beliefs apparently given indulgence of religion and its wokeness like epistemology.

All of you all need to make multiple visits a pentecostal church in the USA and get BORN AGAIN.
THEN ALL QUESTIONS WILL BE ANSWERED.

I hope these atheists that are converting are truly having a miraculous interaction with the holy Spirit and not just doing it because it's hip and cool and what's in style and certainly hope they're not doing it to align themselves politically with other people

A huge problem for Christianity is the lack of Christian yoga or better yogis. They have some in the persons of the great Saints. There is some yogic practice in the Orthodox churches of Eastern Europe and the Near East. But nothing comparable to the authentic Gurus and Saints of India or the great buddhist masters.
These are living examples of the reality of the divine when you are blessed to meet them. Or when you are graced with conviction and will to give yourself to (yoga) practice.

The Cash cow is with the majority, that’s why I am inclined to trust the one who swims against the tide, when Justin’s car breaks down does he pray or call a mechanic? The panel are all nice people but I’m left on my own to find what’s true.

She nailed it

Revival is more like delusional people making claims that we all know are but lies.

the problem is theew is a love of a Christ but a hate of pharisaic corrupt institutions that would make Jesus blush yet claim to be the key to him.

Lots of anger in the comment section. Chill out people.

“One of the saddest lessons of history is this: If we’ve been bamboozled long enough, we tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozle. We’re no longer interested in finding out the truth. The bamboozle has captured us. It’s simply too painful to acknowledge, even to ourselves, that we’ve been taken. Once you give a charlatan power over you, you almost never get it back.”
― Carl Sagan

If you’re the kind of person who believes it’s impossible to make good moral choices without the threat of omnipotent punishment, please stay far away from me.

I loved Alex and his generous approach. However, have to disagree with the way he is interpreting scripture. Jesus, Paul and the patristic writers would too. He automatically uses a very modern method of reading. God is a fast God and Christians and the church are always busy trying to catch up - in Christ there are no Jews and Gentiles, male or female, slave or free. It’s taken 2000 years to understand.

Second religiousness is what even Spengler spoke of.

Utter nonsense to assume that Christian nations have to accept mass immigration ; that is a distortion of Scripture, and pure neo liberalism There are many ways to love and help People. They can be loved and helped in their own countries ; and indeed helped in better and more good ways, which I really do support, as a Christian. ❤️🤝

Wish jordan peterson had been on the panel along with this lady. Because she's more politicising her message on the pro theism side I'd have loved to have seen jordan peterson and maybe a few others there to have pushed back on the people islam side of her aglrguemwnt and also the god shaped hole debate against Alex etc.

This is an admirably pleasant and civil discussion, and I could enjoy a visit with each participant, but it has been low in protein. Much has been said – and implicitly admitted by the semi-atheist – that we humans in these parlous times are anxious, and fearful, and in great need of solace and comfort.
As an actual atheist I will admit that the General Theory of Relativity addresses none of these needs. As a species we are irrational, have an average IQ of 100, have made a mess of this wonderful world, and have every reason to feel insecure. It is certainly arguable that we (most of us, anyway) need religion, even though none of the participants in this “debate” make any effort to substantiate its preposterous dogma.
Let us agree, then, that the world - with us in it - needs religion, for the comfort and guidance it provides us in our deeply flawed weakness. But that’s “religion” with a lower case r. All religions have long agreed upon some version of the Golden Rule. Beyond that, all of their holy books are a mess of nonsense, the reading of which can only drive any thoughtful person away from faith. So let’s advocate embracing some religion - it doesn’t matter which one – as a guide to better behavior, and a comfort against despair, and hope that a resurgence of religious feeling may delay the destruction of this planet for at least a little while.

She is woke. Her thoughts are completely tainted by that, and you don’t have a serious challenger to her.

To have this question you need people like Jordan Peterson.

@CosmicSkeptic the Tom Holland argument for why Christianity is the source of many apparently non-biblical or non-doctrinal liberal reforms is that despite how it may often appear, the key difference with Christianity is that its a religion of the spirit, where 'the law is written on the heart', so this allows for 'constant reformation', listening to 'the spirit' CAN allow you to conclude slavery is wrong, despite several biblical endorsements of it being available. This is certainly true of the form of Christianity I was raised in, Quakerism, where they did keep slaves BUT eventually became ardent abolitionists. Obviously there is a long history of the opposite, very dogmatic, very bible literalist versions of Christianity, so plenty of room to disagree with Tom, but I for one think he may have a point.

What concerns me about embracing a Christian revival is that we would have to be very clear about what kind of Christianity we are talking about, which I'm not sure is piossible or even desireable. I hear British intellectuals wax poetic about the meek and mild kind of Christianity that promotes brotherly love, forgiveness and kindness to one's neighbor - the kind that I imagine has become dominant in the Anglican tradition. Then, I imagine how surprised these same intellectuals would be to find themselves in the same camp as deeply conservative fundamentalist Christians like those in America who attend mega-churches, vote for Trump and would be thrilled by the idea of Christian revival to usher in the end times. Christianity has gone through so many permutations and while, of course atheism doesn't offer any clues about how to live one's life, one would be wrong to expect it to. It doesn't seem productive to me, in the absence of meaning so many seem to feel, to go in reverse and begin cherry picking which Christian values we find agreeable and pretending the others don't exist.

The Protestant sect requires constant “revival”, to get them “high”, or give them that “warm and fuzzy” feeling, because when they became schismatic, following br Martin Luther, they threw the baby out with the bath water. Or to put it better, they through the body of Christ, the real presence, in the Eucharist, out with the holy water. As Jesus instituted and the church taught universally, for over 1500 since his life, passion and resurrection, the church has known, and taught, that after the bread is consecrated by the priest, acting in the stead of Christ, as he commanded, the bread turns to the actual body of Christ. Body, blood, soul and divinity. The greatest miracle occurring at every mass, in every chapel, in every country on every hour of the day, and the greatest act of love to mankind, the giving up of his body for the love of his bride the church. Catholics literally have Christ in them, non Catholic Christian sects, act it out in play, the bread symbolic, ie just bread made by human hands. Requiring constant “revival”, to get those Jesus feelings again. They lost out on the whole central source and summit of the faith in the holy Eucharist. The only form of worship. Bc that’s what mass is for. Worship. To God. It has nothing to do with us. It’s the re-offering of the son to the father, in the holy sacrifice of the mass. How you feel is has nothing to do with it. I woujd t say nothing, consuming thr body, blood, soul, and divinity, completes us, it’s the most all encompassing fullfillment, oneness, joy, elation, that one could only hope for in heaven. No surprise, bc heaven and earth literally connect in the mass. But how we feel, that’s not why we go to church. The Protestant, Any other “Christian” sect, is based in the senses, man is the center, the center of the stage, man’s interpretation on what he thinks the Bible says for him. Has nothing to do with worship. Singing songs, good. Reading scripture together, great. But it’s not worship, do that on a weds night, have your band, eat your picnic, have a good time and revive your warm and fuzzies in community. But true wholeness, known for the first 1500 years and till today, no revival is needed, for one who literally communes with God, as often as he/she desires. If people only knew. There would be no depression, anxiety.

That anti vax display from the audience member towards the end really brought the mood down. People like that make it difficult to respect the Christian community at times.

The gentleman in the light blue shirt is not very bright, I wonder what he's doing on this panel?

Even Alex managed to misrepresent atheism somehow

I can see Alex O'Connor is in a journey.

Ya'll got the pedos out yet?

That lightning is shit.

Wow, this is just a long boring pro Christian infomercial. Wth happened to Alex's brain? He's saying secularism and humanism can't have moral a framework?

There is no christian revival...there is however a significant abandonement of outdated belief systems requiring the existance of an invisible being ruling the universe. One need only to look at the fundamental story of Jesus Christ to understand the absurdity and willingness ignorance people subject themselves to derive meaning in life. So this invisible celestial entity rapes a 13 year old girl for the express purpose of recreating himself to then torture and kill himself to save ourselves from ourselves. Truly fucking stupid.