12 gauge vs. 45-70 gov't for Bear and Moose Defense in Alaska

Both will work

Slug you should test: Brenneke 1-1/2oz. "Crush" rifled slug, but needs to be from a rifled barrel. Tyranosaur rated...

45 70

Here in Montana we have a grizzly explosion, along with mtn lions, wolves and black bears. I'm 72 and spend alot of time in the mtns cutting wood. Waterproofing is not a consideration, but I have an 870 with slugs close by, or will also have a .460/.500 S&W handy. I NEVER go out solo, always have a pard who also carries, can never be too safe! So far, our only "close encounter" has been a couple of angry squirrels! Be safe!

12 gauge with a slug barrel and a scope. So if you're close range you point long range you aim.

Pistol & rifle ammo is generally waterproof but if in doubt use clear nail polish around the edge of the primer then apply where the bullet meets the cartridge getting it on top the crack and wipe immediately off with cotton rag let dry 24 hours. Worked for different pistol and rifle rounds in powerheads down to 105 ft. I tried non-treat rounds to 85 ft depth multiple dive no failures.

Correct the title, It's for Alaskan bear, not Alaskan Bears.
The word bear when applied to the animal is already plural

I wouldn't carry either one

And had you chose 3 inch or 31/2 & compare them to 45-70😃

Both are excellent rounds.

1301 w/Breneke black magic or green lightning slugs is always by my side!

M60

Man i can just feel myy fingers goin numb.....

I don't like guns. I just bring my fat friends along. 🤣

Great test and comments. I don't own a .45/70, but i do have an Ithaca model 87 featherweight deerslayer with a rifled barrel. I mounted a Nikon Slughunter 2 x 7 power scope for balance of accuracy plus target aquisition. For deer, elk, etc, i run the extremely accurate Hornady SST's in 300 grains. They only drop 12.5 inches at 200 yards, so i call it my "12 gauge rifle." I would definitely upgrade the range of the SST's for a heavier hard cast slug after watching your video and reading the comments. Also, waterproofing slugs is something I'd never considered until now. My Ithaca only holds three 2.75 inch rounds, won't take 3" either. More rounds doesn't concern me much as you won't get many shots, and the need for an accurate first shot is critical. Someday, I may get a .45/70, but i haven't so far as I live in Washington State, and the Ithaca with the 300 grain SST's is adequate for anything I'm likely to run into, with the possible exception of grizzly. I'm going to get some hard cast heavier saboted slugs, though. And waterproof them. If i was using it strictly for big bear defense, I'd remove the Nikon 2 x 7 scope and mount a rear peep sight like so many of the .45/70's come with. I have 2 muzzleloaders that i put rear peep sights on due to my astigmatism making buckhorn rear sights not ideal, even if they are fibre optic. I own a .41 magnum Ruger and a Kenai Chest Holster that would come with me. Normally i carry my .357 with 180 grain Buffalo Bullets when I'm alone. When i had clients fishing in brown bear country, I carried a stainless 12 gauge 870 pistol grip with 3 inch Brenneke slugs. I carried bear spray, an air horn, and a flare gun to round out my non-lethal options. I had to spray an aggressive brown bear once, and it was effective. The flares work well when a bear is slowly aproaching on a gravel bar, with no danger of setting the forest on fire. The air horn is more effective than some realize, but hard cast lead is what i believe in. The .45/70 is appealing and has its advantages, but shot placement trumps everything else. I no longer have my pistol grip 870, and that makes me more likely to get a .45/70. Thanks to you, Chuke, and to all who commented to give me a great basis for options. 🐻

wat up chuck chuke always shouting u out in all his vids! Can't wait to make it back up to talkeetna and kenia

12 pipe hands down and if you end up in a survival situation any camp you may take shelter in will have some form of ammo

I don't no if anyone has tried the Hornady SST !!! They are a 325 grain ballistics tip they make nice big holes,and great fir taking out lots of vitals!!! I would think this is the slugg you guys would want to use!!!And also the 3 1/2 inch OO BUCKSHOTS, i never hete of anyone talking about this load!!! But if i lived where most of you guys do, BOY I'LL TELL YOU WHAT,YOU WANT A BUCKSHOT LOAD THERE YOU GO!!! YOU WANT TO HANG ON TO IT, BUT WITH A MUZZLE BREAK THEY WORK REALLY GOOD, LOTS AND LOTS OF STOPING POWER !!! JUST SAY'N!!!! 😊

Do not use 12 gauge for bear defence. I personally know a retired fish and game officer who’s had to shoot many bears in his time. He told me that he used 12 gauge slugs up until when he shot a charging bear and the slug redirected off its shoulder bone or skull and it survived and ran off. (Bear was killed later on and they found that out) In terms of what you should carry you want a rifle round that’s at least decently heavy and moving fast enough to cause a stretch cavity. Just like how many people survive pistol wounds in self defence encounters. The slower bullets are only boring out a hole that size of the bullet. Lots of people recommend slugs and 10mm but you have to remember the scale of a massive brown bear. Once these bullets hit and have to travel through the hide and flesh and bone and reach a vital area they are slowed drastically.

Similarly to when a hunter is gearing up to take big game ethically they take a big fast moving rifle calibre. They don’t pack a 12 gauge and a 10mm. The time you have to shoot is small so if you have some giga black magic ultra slug it’s still not going to create a stretch cavity and your follow up shots will be hard if you even get any. The best option I see is something semi automatic in .308
This will hit hard enough to kill and cause a stretch cavity. While most likely still being able to get a few more shots off then a massive slug round.

Trust me I’ve done a lot of research into ballistics after hearing the Timothy Treadwell mauling audio.

12 gauge or 45-70? Would you rather be hit by a train or an 18 wheeler? Sometimes...it just doesn't matter. LOL!

It all depends on the ammo .the old brenike slugs would penetrate approximately 14 inches of live yellow pine.

Awesome

How come your ammo is wearing finger nail polish 😂

Awesome video thanks

Awnser to the question is the one you own

What about other gauges , like : .410 , 28 gauge , etc . ?

I just found your channel. It's funny that you're from MS, and living in AK. I'm from the MS Delta, my teens and 20's had me living in the pine belt of MS, and then I moved to the southwestern Tundra of AK. I'm intrigued by the .45-70, but I've been successful with my .308 on moose and black bear. When I go to the coastal regions around Dillingham or Goodnews Bay for brown bear, I take my .338 win mag. I wonder if you've compared the ballistics of the .338 wm with a .45-70.

I see Black Bears waljing thru my property in Connecticut. Should I be worried?

Why dont you compare a 31/2 magnum shell then compare with the 4570

Look at the caliber comparison. 12 guage loaded hot.

When I was a kid my neighbors wife shot a bear that broke through their sliding glass doors. She used a 2 oz slug and when me and my dad went over to see what was going on I saw the bear's head was split like a taco above the jaw. I only saw it for like a split second because my dad rushed me back to the truck but that image was ingrained in my brain. Idk if they make flat 2oz slugs anymore but Quakemaker Slugs come in 2 1/2 oz

You are a LOSER and a shit head that don't know NOTHING about anything. Your here because you shoot once in a while and produce videos for the money. You deleted me again , I DONT CARE

Vax for water/ moisture proofing...?

How do you water proff your rounds?

As a newbie as a gun owner, I would choose my 12 gauge over my 45-70 for one simple reason: I can fit four 3" slugs in my 12 gauge, while my CVA Scout is a single shot 45-70. Good fun gun, good hunting rifle, but not my first choice as a defensive gun.

As a newbie as a gun owner, I would choose my 12 gauge over my 45-70 for one simple reason: I can fit four 3" slugs in my 12 gauge, while my CVA Scout is a single shot 45-70. Good fun gun, good hunting rifle, but not my first choice as a defensive gun.

When in bear country i always have my redhawk 44mag in a cross-draw holster with hardcast. I have a 870 with penetrator slugs that I bring along should I have the opportunity to be able to get to it. So many stories of cleaning game or cutting firewood (in my case) with the rifle or whatever leaning next to the tree or nearby.

Reading through the comments section after a couple of years since this was posted is cracking me up. All of the "internet experts" giving their opinions based on...what exactly? There are several comments from experts here, those people who have actually experienced bear and/or moose attacks in Alaska, but there are hundreds upon hundreds of comments from people who have probably never fired any gun at all at a person or animal trying to hurt them, yet they have a HUGE opinion about it. Me? I've only had to defend against people with my gun and pepper sprayed one dog during my years as a Police Officer...lol. Even though I'm a firearms instructor there is no way I'm giving ballistic advice to people who've actually had to shoot or try to survive an encounter with a bear or moose attacking them.

"YOU NEED TO SPEND MONEY TO STOP AMMO GETTING WET"

That problem ended in 1968 when the ziploc bag was invented, this is a dumb point in the year 2025 :p

Theres other point that are valid at times, but this is a dumb one.😊

Why was this recommended after me watching Kevin holland be a douche to rampage about 45-70😭

I've lived in Kodiak, Alaska all my life. My dad, grandfather and great grandfather always told me to carry a .22 when fishing in bear country. They said the .22 is a very lightweight gun and If a bear ever attacked us, to just shoot your friend in the leg so the bear doesn't get you - I've always got home safe. Well I'm off to VFW to make more friends.

I rarely ever hunt alone.
I understand you wo t always have that luxury but it feels better knowing we got eachothers backs.
We split the hauls and go have pints later.

Im writing this on 02 02 2025. Why is it we in Alaska cannot get certain ammo?

I would say 12 gauge before watching.

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Come up north!😢

Every single video I've been watching about using steel, has had really bad penetration problems. I think to give the shotgun a fair chance you needed to use lead

I'm glad for both that bears 🐻 don't watch this channel nor carry guns...

Thanks for sharing ths with everyone.